She inspired Journey, passed on Playboy & that’s not the most interesting part about Tane McClure

If somebody tells you, hey, yeah, I don't have any regrets, instant red flag.
Mac Engle, footwear start telegram, Engle Engle podcast.
Here on The Sunset Lounge, thank you very much for joining me.
I am so excited to introduce my guest for this episode.
I chased her down for several months, and she was always very nice and receptive,
but our schedules couldn't line up.
And finally, they did.
And I recorded this a while back.
But finally now I'm getting in a chance to roll this one out,
and I hope you enjoyed as much as I do.
Her name is Tony McClure.
Now, you might look at that name and say, Tony McClure, Tony McClure,
why do I know that name?
I know that name.
Why do I know that name?
You might see your face.
And say, Tony McClure, I know that.
Why do I know that face?
Why do I know that name?
Why do I know that face?
Well, because she's been around since she was 17 years old,
when she was started her career as a professional singer.
And since then, she went on to become a professional singer,
and eventually an actress, director, writer, producer,
and in a very obscure detail, an editor.
Most women didn't get into film editing, and Tony did,
because she did everything.
Probably the thing that you would remember her the most
from the biggest project she was ever ever involved in,
I think, when looking at her mile long resume,
she was in legally blonde, one and two,
with Reese Witherspoon.
She had a supporting role in that.
But long before then, when she started out,
Tony started out one of these careers
that when you look back on it, say, holy, God, how did you do that?
And as I get older, and I've covered professional entertainment,
professional sports, been in medium myself,
I have a great amount of respect and appreciation for people
who scratch out careers in these cutthroat industries
where the high end makes a ton, then the middle makes okay,
and the bottom makes nothing.
So for Tony, and a whole lot of people like her,
they may not necessarily be household names.
But when you look at their resumes,
you put some respect on that, because that's not easy.
That's a hard road to go to do what you love.
And I realize this now, it is great to win awards and things like that.
But the real reward, the real award,
rather, is the reward in being able to do what you want to do
and make enough money to be able to support yourself.
That's the award.
The other ones are cool, they look great on a shelf,
and they're neat, but they're fleeting.
And while no one can take them away from you,
the real cherished accomplishment to me,
and that's just to me, is for people who have the ability
to be able to do what they really, really want to do
and pursue creative endeavors,
and make enough in return to support themselves.
And certainly, Tony McClure has done that.
She started her career when she was 17 years old as a singer,
and she went on to record.
She actually had a career where she was compared favorably to Pat Venitar.
Tony didn't really love that comparison.
She was more of a grace slick fan,
but comparisons happen organically,
and there's really not much you can do about it.
She had a song recorded in the 80s called Hold None
that went to number 37 on the Billboard charts.
I know how he said, well, it's not 27, it's not seven.
That's number one.
Think about all of the music that's recorded in a given year.
And if your song climbs to 37,
do you know how hard that is?
She also recorded a song just coincidentally called Danger Zone
in the 80s.
That one really didn't find an audience.
Coincidentally, Danger Zone eventually did find an audience
when it was recorded by Kenny Loggins,
and it was used for the Top Gun soundtrack.
Now, I want to be clear about this.
Tony's song Danger Zone is not the Kenny Loggins song.
They were just shared the same title name.
But speaking of soundtracks,
Tony did have three songs that were used
on the Terminator soundtrack.
That's right.
Tony McClure's songs are on the Terminator soundtrack,
including maybe a song, pardon me, a song that is associated
with maybe the most famous scene in the film
with the exception of Arnold Schwarzenegger saying,
I'll be back.
Please note that I made no attempt to mimic
or do in kind of Arnold Schwarzenegger impressionably.
He said, I'll be back.
Tony's song was in the background.
If you watch the film where you remember the movie
when Arnold Schwarzenegger and the Terminator
meet Sarah Conner for the first time
in a nightclub in Los Angeles before he shoots it all to hell.
That's Tony McClure's song.
Now she had two other songs on that track as well.
And she has other little details about her life
and her career, including her marriage
to one of the more prominent figures
and the band Journey that you're going to want to listen to,
things that you would say, no, way, I can't believe it
in her very, very much true.
Eventually she'd get out of the music game
and she went into acting.
She started in just a whole bunch of TV shows and movies,
including she, I can't believe I didn't ask about this.
She was in days of our lives.
No one loved Bo and Hope.
Well, forget that.
No one loved Hope more than me when I was a kid.
She was in a whole bunch of movies and TV shows
that you wouldn't necessarily know.
I don't think all of them.
Some of them maybe.
But including in that, she started a lot of, I would say,
bee thrillers, films, things like that.
And she also had some spots in the very, very popular,
often made fun of, but very popular,
cinematics after dark series.
She eventually wanted to become a director.
She directed a documentary titled,
Fun with Dick and Jerry Van Dyke.
That she did so many things.
She also did a documentary that I highly recommend watching
with Betty White and about her incredible career
before she passed, obviously.
And she recently, Tony recently,
co-wrote and directed,
a short that came out over the summer called Last Flare.
Based on the true story of a shipping accident,
or part of me, a fishing vessel accident,
off the coast of Southern California.
It's called Last Flare.
You can find that online.
Please welcome my guest, Tony McClure.
I want to, before I ask you anything,
some of this comes from Wikipedia,
which, as you know, may not be entirely accurate.
And a lot of it comes from IMDB,
which I think is probably a little bit more accurate.
Is that safe to say?
Okay.
So you were raised in Hawaii, correct?
Yeah, partially in Hawaii.
And partially in the Los Angeles area,
because my mother and father divorced when I was really young.
So I went to school at Punaho School in Hawaii,
but then the summers I would spend in California
with my dad.
So kind of, yeah.
So when I read about your career,
I met you as an actress.
I really had seen you and legally blonde,
which is I'm sure is same for a lot of us.
But then I started looking you up.
I didn't realize you had a pretty good music career
there back in the 80s.
Yes.
What prompted you, first of all, to go into,
because this is what Wikipedia says.
I don't know if you've seen this or not,
your break was in a Latin jazz band.
No, that isn't entirely true.
But I wasn't a Latin jazz band.
Okay.
And actually, I have seen that on Wikipedia.
And it's sort of true.
When I was in Pebble Beach living with my father,
I was like, I left living in Hawaii when I was 17.
And I could sing because my grandmother on my mother's side
was actually an opera singer.
So she had a grand piano in the living room.
And she was always singing and playing.
And so I singing kind of came naturally to me.
Obviously, the entertainment industry came relatively naturally,
because my father was an actor, blah, blah.
But I was singing all the time,
and basically befriended some people.
And then I just kind of like, you know,
evolved into a singer for this Latin jazz band.
And it was really fun.
And, you know, I played around with my voice.
And next thing I know, I realized I could actually really sing.
And I started pursuing singing more than acting for a short period of time.
And I got signed to what had multiple record offers,
but RCA records and things like that.
And so, yeah.
So.
So along the way, you meet your first husband,
one of the founding members of the band, Journey, Jonathan King.
Correct.
Okay.
So then you're together.
It's come up about you.
And this is one of those things that sounds like it could be urban myth,
or it sounds like it could be 100% true.
Were you, are you the inspiration for the journey hitsong faithfully?
Yes.
Wow.
Does anybody ask you about that anymore?
They do.
It's really strange.
My singing career.
Okay.
So, I actually was a pretty darn good singer, but I was young.
I married.
When I met Jonathan King, I was a singer.
And he was in a band called The Babies.
He was not in Journey.
And I already had a record deal offer from Atlantic records.
And some interested Geffen records.
Before he was even in Journey.
And then when we got together, he was a really good songwriter.
And we were working together.
And he wrote some great songs for me.
And then after he joined Journey, I got an offer from Columbia Records,
which was Journey's label.
RCA records.
Atlantic records.
Atlantic records, all this kind of stuff.
And I decided to go with the RCA records because I like this guy,
Joan Moundsfield, who was vice president.
That's a super long story short.
Really like what they were saying for my career.
But this is a little bit of information.
I'm kind of jumping ahead on the story because I think it's important.
My name is Tony McClure.
That's my maiden name.
And even though I'm now married again and my husband's name is,
aren't I still for professional?
I keep McClure.
And there's reason why that is because when I married very young,
I was 21 and I married Jonathan Kane.
He was like nine years older than me.
And he's insisted that I change my name to Tony Kane for my record deal.
And I didn't want to.
I was like, please don't know.
And I was young, you know, and younger than him.
And he was very, you know, like you have to change.
Why didn't you want to change your tone?
Because I felt because when we met, he wasn't in journey.
But when I got signed, he was in journey.
Even though I got offered to be at the same label,
I didn't go with them.
I didn't want anybody thinking and ended up being totally true
that I got my record deal because of him.
Or I got this because he was in journey because that's not how it happened.
That's not how it happened, right?
And I didn't want to be, have it be kind of weights on my ankles.
And it was for my career.
It actually was so damaging, so damaging.
So it totally worked against you.
Oh, my God.
Yeah. And especially when he and I split up,
it was just, it was really bad.
But he did write the song faithfully for me.
And I think partly because we were starting to have some trouble.
A lot of it had to do with, I was a very independent person.
And I wanted to do have my own career.
And he was more, he was, you know, he was ready to have kids and settle down.
And I wasn't at the time.
So, you know, the age difference, even though it's not that much, nine years.
But when you're 21, you just become like legal drinking age and you marry a guy.
And he's like, you know, and he was in the babies.
And I'm like, okay, cool.
Or good music partners.
And then he gets in journey.
And then he's like, you need to stay home.
I'm like, so.
And so, that's why things didn't work out.
But that's a long and story short of why the song was written for me.
And it didn't work out.
Do you have any.
So obviously that song has endured for 40 years.
That's ridiculous.
And the song is about you, which is great.
But considering the relationship ended.
Do you have any mixed feelings about it now and anymore?
Or if you face that of that.
I mean, everything's fine.
I mean, I was actually fairly.
I don't know what the word is.
Yeah, I was fairly damaged by how my music career got crushed.
That's what I was going to get into.
You were asking me to people ask me very often about faithfully.
And they do a lot now.
It's the strangest thing.
Even though it was a legitimate singer with train voice, the whole nine yards.
I got beat up so bad after he and I split up with the press and the this and the that.
Oh, she got fined because she was with journey.
Here's the funny thing.
There was even a rumor and even kind of still was revolving.
That supposedly I was like a Millie Vanille fake band.
And like,
when I just recently cleared up on Reddit, I couldn't believe it.
There were like, oh, no, you know, she was a studio band.
They didn't really have a band.
I was like,
you got to look into it a little bit more because the songs, like the like the terminator soundtrack, all that stuff was my band.
Written by my band because we went on tour together.
We were real.
So, but I was heard by that.
And when I was young,
I wasn't as emotionally resilient.
So I took the critics that said, oh, she's not as good as Pat Bennett are because they said they sounded like her.
She's not there. She's not that.
And I went, oh, I guess I'm not, I'm not, I'm not.
And it messed me up right now.
And then messing up in a real bad way.
But I lost all the confidence.
And even though I kept singing.
And I was with another record label called WTG CBS Records afterwards.
They signed me for like the track.
It took a lot of the singing sales,
wind out of my sales, so to speak.
And it's been shocking over the last decade.
How many fans I have.
More so on the Terminator soundtrack.
The song you got me burning in the third year,
which I didn't know you're on.
I was.
Yeah.
And that was as as Jonathan can and I were splitting up.
And I wrote that.
And here's the really sad part.
I could not get a really good record deal after my insult.
What was because your relationship ended?
Yeah.
And there was a couple of things.
That's a really long story I could tell you.
But you know, it was really heartbreaking.
And how now.
Well, actually it's one of the main reasons why Jonathan and I split up.
Turns out I had.
There was a band that Kevin Ellsson, who is.
Oh,
was one of the producers that I had worked with.
And it also worked with Journey.
Loved you got me burning.
And that demo track was originally was a demo.
And had played it for a band in England.
And they were like, oh my god, I love this, this chick's voice.
I want to let's she's basically walk in and have another record deal.
With this band to be the lead singer of the band.
Well, Jonathan got the message from the producer and neglected on purpose to ever tell me.
So.
Oh, yeah.
So we broke up after that.
And it's because he didn't want me to go to England.
But anyways, my point is.
Wow.
Yeah.
What did you when you found out about that?
We split up.
That was it.
That was it.
I was, I was like, that was it.
I was at.
But anyways, the point is, is that.
I didn't think I was very good because nothing was working out.
And over the last decade, it's been so sweet.
I've had such a great amount of fans that have said, oh my god, your voice is so wonderful.
How come you didn't, you know, the after the terminator soundtrack.
How come you didn't like, oh, because nobody was appreciating me eating meat at the time.
It's like, it is like.
So because of that, I don't think I stopped singing completely because I did.
I'd sing on soundtracks.
I'd sing on this and thing on that or whatever.
But I just started shifting my career like a chameleon and started becoming more of an actress.
So, you know, that's how that kind of happened.
So when you did, when you were recording, I had read this.
And you mentioned the Pat Meditar thing.
Obviously, Pat Meditar was a huge name back in the 80s.
Huge.
And whomever that you didn't want to be compared to Pat Meditar.
That you wanted to be compared, not necessarily compared, was Grace Slick.
And that is, okay.
There's a couple of reasons for that.
I mean, neither is wrong. Grace is terrific.
Oh, she's great. Probably truthfully.
Again, we're talking, I was in my early 20s, right?
Truthfully, I probably did sound more like Pat Meditar.
But I technically am a contralto singers out there.
And Pat Meditar's got some soprano chops.
And I'm really more of a, even though she's an alto, but she's got some soprano chops.
I'm not. I'm more of an alto contralto.
So Grace Slick, who actually opened for a few times,
when she was in, you know, Jefferson Starship in Vegas and some other place I can't remember where.
You open for Grace Slick.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, I was rocking.
And this is a little funny.
Okay. So we were in Las Vegas.
And I try to remember what, what big venue we were at.
Like seizures or something with the seizures have been around back then?
Yeah, I can't remember.
A similar one time.
Everybody's voice, because I've been on tour.
I was on tour before that with Eddie Money.
And I was on tour a lot with my band.
And we were going everywhere.
And everybody was sort of losing their voice.
So I kind of called my doctor cheated a little bit.
Called my doctor in LA Beverly Hills area.
And I saw losing my voice, whatever he gave me.
I'm just telling you everything.
He gave me a prescription for like, like a type of steroid, but it's for your voice.
Like if you're losing your voice, it's nothing bad.
It's just, you know, help me out.
So all of a sudden, my voice comes back.
I'm doing the, the sound check.
My voice is like,
you don't like it.
And I'm like, you know,
I don't got it.
And then afterwards I walk back.
And Gracelick is standing kind of like on the sidelines watching me.
And she's like, damn girl.
And I'm like, I walk up to her.
And I'm like, Oh, my God.
I'm such a fan.
I've been fan of yours since I was a little kid.
She's like getting an autograph for something.
Yeah.
And she means she goes,
Okay.
You know,
I think she was trying to like, talk to me like,
like, one on one kind of like,
how did, you know,
how you're making you,
how's your voice,
like gonna come, come rottery or whatever.
And I'm like fanning out like,
like,
and you know, when you,
you don't,
we win then.
We don't necessarily like to be told,
I have been a fan of yours since I've been a little kid,
especially the age difference doesn't feel at the moment that big, you know.
She's like, great.
Yeah.
Thanks.
I'm your mother.
So you were going,
you record a song,
holding on,
gets to 37 on the Billboard charts.
Now, you have another song in 1982 that has a wildly popular title,
but it doesn't make it.
You were the OG of Danger Zone.
Oh, Danger Zone.
Yeah.
Right.
You just kind of mentioned something that I thought about for a long time,
and I don't know how you all performers do it,
which is this idea of,
I just produce something,
and I know it's pretty good,
and it doesn't find an audience.
How does that not just wreck your self-esteem?
Hmm.
Or does it?
No, it does.
It's good.
But we just need to be through the air.
Right.
But I don't know.
Have a theory,
because you kind of were mentioning,
and lately people have,
in my older years,
how have you had all these different careers,
and everything like that,
you know,
and producing,
it's like,
what in the world?
For some reason,
there's something about me,
and I've been trying to figure it out,
that has this,
well, I can do that.
Which is almost comical.
So with that said,
when I was growing up with my father,
so I have something,
I'm like,
I'm perfect for when we're on camera, right?
That's good.
It's probably an eyelash from my mascara.
When I was growing up with my father,
my father wasn't avid a question,
and he, you know,
really introduced me to horses and things like that.
And if you're,
if you are a horse person,
you know one of the sayings
is if you follow up your horse,
what he's supposed to do.
Yeah, good.
Get back on.
Yeah, get right back on.
And that actually happened to me.
Clunked.
My devil.
All right.
All right.
I'm right.
Okay.
You're all right.
Get back on.
But I love horses,
so I get back on.
So watching my father also go as an actor,
in case anybody's watching,
my father was actor Doug McClure
from the Western series,
a Virginian and other things.
He was,
when I was younger,
a pretty big star.
And he had a super great attitude,
very humble,
very, you know, upbeat and stuff.
And he had things
that didn't work all the time.
And I saw him,
I don't know how he did it either,
but it's contagious.
Just kind of go.
All right.
And get back up on the horse
no matter what the situation is.
It's funny.
There's a country song
that I just heard today
for the first time.
And I'm not at myself
because I can't think of the,
the singers.
I was not the worst.
Yeah, I just,
and today,
I was listening to it.
And I'm like,
oh, my God, I love this song so much.
I have to remember.
I can't remember the artist.
But the song is called,
um,
backup plan.
You don't need a backup plan.
What the only backup plan you need
is that you get.
Back up.
You.
I want to like Google it.
Can anybody Google it for me?
That's good.
It is.
That's a good one.
So good.
That my plan was to actually
post about it on social media,
saying,
this is how I feel.
My backup plan.
Is to get back on it.
No matter what it is,
it's like shake it off.
And you know,
you know,
you know,
you know,
you know,
you know,
is to get back on it.
The no matter what it is,
it's like,
shake it off and get,
get back on it.
So it kind of almost makes me laugh
when I really think about it,
which I guess it's a good thing.
It's.
Well she can't sing.
Well, she can't act.
Oh,
she can't ride.
I'm a profession.
She can't direct.
She's long.
She can produce.
Oh,
you edit.
No, women can't.
said to me, I just, a lot of times it's just, wow, because where would that even
come from?
Yeah, where would it come from?
What?
Where would it come from?
Right.
Because nobody told you that to your face, Tony.
Nobody said, you can't act.
You can't.
Did they?
No.
But I have had somebody say to me on the phone call, he's a friend of mine, he's a male
director.
He said, women can't direct.
Not that he was saying, I can't direct, it was about something it was about to do.
And I went, I started.
And he goes, what?
And I'm like, well, okay, I'm still going to direct.
Okay, you've done this forever.
Why would anybody, I'm thinking, I'm thinking Catherine Bigelow, she wins for her locker.
Right.
I'm thinking Greta Gerwig, she probably should have won, she didn't, I can't remember.
Why did that even, why did, why was that like a thing?
You know, I think human nature, and I've kind of learned this over the years, is to
categorize people.
It's just, it's just the way we kind of work.
And I don't know if it's a safety valve or what, you meet somebody, you say good person,
bad person, safe person, not person, that person's a police officer, this is a gangster,
this person, I'm simplifying it, but this person is, works at the post office, this person
does this, this person does that.
And you, and it doesn't mean everybody's trying to be horrible.
But when all of a sudden, well, no, really, but sometimes, yes, you see somebody that
works at the post office, not just think about this, you go to the mail, you go to the
post office, there's behind the counter, and all of a sudden, they're singing a song
in the nightclub and they're damn good.
Don't tell me you're not going to go like this.
Yeah, you're right.
Nope, you're right.
That's human nature.
You're right.
Then add insecurities that people all have, jealousy, and all those things that are damaging
to, you know, I personally think knocking somebody else down if they're succeeding is super
damaging to yourself.
So, you know, I really do.
And I think that when people do that, it's not healthy in general, you know, to, but
there's, there's that.
So you have to be resilient.
You have to kind of, you know, when you're, when you're working to do something and it's
really difficult, whatever it was, even when my outbreak or my album came out, I had friends
that I could tell were like, are you going to do that?
And they were kind of like, they're on the sideline ready to trip you, you know, but then
when you really start to go and I was touring and everything, then they're cheering.
So it's like human nature.
So once you realize that people are like that, not everybody, but they're like that, then
you just go, yeah, okay, and you just, you just keep going forward.
And that's how I look at things and I do some things.
So if I want to do it, I do it, but that doesn't mean they won't take a ton of hard work.
I mean, I am, I'm a technical professional editor.
I've been a professional editor for 20 years and doing it took a ton of hard work.
And when I first started learning to be an editor, I remember my daughter, I think she
was like, how does she know?
Well, God's has been more than 20 years, I guess.
I started it when she was just like two years old or whatever.
And she's 26.
So I would carry these, uh, because in those days, because she'll die, they didn't do so
many things necessarily online or anything.
So I would carry these like telephone book, it's another old thing.
Telephone book size manuals around while my daughter would be doing these like lay classes
or ballerina.
Well, it actually must have been like three or whatever or she started doing those things.
And I'm trying to read through these giant manuals and I'm practically in tears because
I'm going, what made me think that I could learn how to be an editor?
Well, you did it and the parts that, as I sit here and look at your resume, you know,
the one that really, I didn't, I didn't know this.
You mentioned the terminator soundtrack.
And I have learned that through talking to actors and actresses is that, look, if you're
in a movie, that movie is a director's medium.
Your time on camera and all those different things that you're kind of at the whim of the
director, depending on who you are as an actor.
Now, if you're really, really big, maybe you've got some influence.
But you're at the, you know, you're at their discretion how they're going to use you.
And I don't know how that pertains to a soundtrack because your track, the one that I remember
vividly is from a really famous scene in that movie when Schwarzenegger comes in and shoots
a nightclub up and the song in the background is you.
Yes.
I didn't know that.
A lot of people think it's happened at all.
And you know what?
I can, I can hear the song in my head.
I've seen that scene a thousand times that there's Linda Hamilton, there's Michael
Bean.
It's extremely intense.
It's a great scene.
James Cameron did a, it's a phenomenal scene.
Did you have any idea where they were going to put your music in there when you watch
it?
I'll be damned.
There's my song.
Right.
No, I did not.
What?
How much time do we have?
That's a funny story.
Oh, I've got as much time as you want.
This is more of a question.
This is your life.
You're giving me your time.
So if you can talk for a month, if you want, this is great.
Okay.
In a small way or maybe a big way, this movie, what here is part of the reason why I became
an editor.
Why?
It's kind of stuck in the back of my mind.
I was like, I don't know, 24 or something like that.
My manager at the time, Bud Carr, was trying to get me signed to New Label and maybe it
was 25.
He's trying to get me signed to New Label.
He loved, you got me burning in the third degree and a couple of bunch of other songs
and I was still partying the tour.
He was also music coordinating for a lot of different movies that was like, and he still
does it now.
He's a great guy.
He came to me and he says, look, I believe I can place your song in a new movie out coming
out by this director by the name James Cameron.
And I went, who?
No, nobody had any idea who it was back then.
Right.
And he goes, yeah, well, you know, it's a good opportunity.
Trust me.
Trust me.
It's good.
I'm like, okay.
All right.
Whatever.
I did, you know, to have my songs as, you know, as a main writer on it.
And we go to a screening of the rough, it's a rough assembly of the terminator.
There's no music.
No music yet.
My music's not in there.
Brad Fidel's score is not in there.
Not all the special effects are not in there.
The sound effects are not even there.
This is an early viewing for just me, Linda Hamilton, my manager, Michael Bane, James
Cameron.
I can't remember.
All sorts of things.
Was Arnold there?
Huh?
Was Arnold there?
No, he was not there.
Okay.
So we're sitting in this small screening.
And I can't remember how come I got it.
I think my manager was trying to get me more involved and stuff like that.
So I went to watch it.
And I'm watching this movie and it's got that half made, you know, mechanical terminator
guy and he's coming down like this, but it's not all fully creative.
And there's in it, there's like a text that comes up that says, um, special effects or
VFX here, they were going to add some more specs to it.
And so I'm watching it.
I'm like, okay.
Remember, I'm a little cocky little 20 something, right?
We go out, we're coming out of this crazy, bud car says to me, which they, what you think?
And I'm like, that was the worst movie I ever saw in my whole life.
And he goes, he goes, he goes, he goes, he's so mad at me.
I'm just like, it's your trash in the terminator.
Yeah.
Okay.
So now we remember I grew up in the industry with my father, but it was the Westerns and
things like that.
They didn't have all these sci-fi mechanical effects and, you know, with all the need and
sound effects and the music and the, okay, so months, months and months and months go
by.
And now I'm invited, my manager still told me to behave.
And we're going to the red carpet screening and I go and I'm half excited, whatever.
And I'm looking at this big red carpet and we've kind of dressed more than I was.
And I'm watching this movie and I am 100% the Lord.
My mouth was like this.
It was so good, so chilling.
The sound effects, Brad Feidel's soundtrack were the terminate, were the burning and
the third degree in photo playing.
You can't do that.
Those three songs were in the movie come in, especially burning through, I'm like this.
It was at that time, I have to say it was probably the best movie I'd ever seen in my
whole life.
It was so innovative and the sound effects just think about it and then, like, all those
sounds.
I was, oh God, humble pie and I was so great.
So in the back of my mind, I realized that as an editor and as sound effects and all
that stuff, a movie is like building, you know, really 10 layered cake, you know.
And so later, later, later, when I started producing, I produced a movie, Trans, called
Trans.
We, of course, movie I would produce.
We went over budget.
Hey, I'm cheering everything with you.
That's great.
That's funny.
That's not my money.
It's fun.
Get back.
We're going to back on points.
It's fine.
Right.
So we, we couldn't finish it right away until we could close a deal with a distribution
company that would do post for it.
And, you know, so they did, we close a deal with jail media and they did the post for it
and everything like that.
It did, you know, it did okay and it's actually out now.
It's still out.
You can watch it on, so you can watch it on Amazon, on, on 2B and stuff like that.
It's called Trans.
It's a quirky horror film.
My long and short of it is I was so frustrated because I was one of the co-readers of that
and the producer of that.
And I was mad at myself and I said, the next project I do, I realized, this is, this
is what happened.
This is around 2001 or two or something like that.
I went, I know, I'll just, I'll just become an editor and then, you know, anything
I produce.
And I can make sure, finish it, to be easy.
That was your solution.
All be the editor.
All be the editor.
It's good.
You try to learn.
Well, it's good.
You try to meet the phone book.
I was like, what?
All right.
It's break time.
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You do that and you've got to use a career that doesn't launch the way you want and then
you do, I wouldn't say a right turn, but you go down a different road and say, I'm going
to do acting and everything I've ever talked to, I've ever talked to actors and actresses
as that is a brutal industry to try to crack.
Your dad had done it.
You had been exposed to it as a kid and now you're knocking on doors and you're a pretty
blonde woman in Southern California where there are a lot of pretty blonde women, a lot
of pretty blonde women and what did you learn when you started knocking on those doors
tiny about trying to land parts, because it sounds incredibly hard.
Well, okay, so at first, I don't know if I was, I'm this is going to sound slightly arrogant.
I actually ended up becoming a really good actress, but I think in the very beginning when
I was dabbling late 20s, even before that, I had done a little bit of acting when I was
like 1920 here and there.
I was in, I was in crawl space on the couple movies, but life experience is what can really
make you a better actress and I was studying a lot of acting because I realized my dad made
it look so easy when I was growing up.
It looked like he could just walk out there and just be natural and do it and I realized
there is a technique to it.
My dad had actually studied acting quite a bit.
So when the bigger breaks, I should say, started to sort of come my way kind of, there
was movies like Fatal Attraction and Basic Instinct that were really, really popular and that
was, there were risqué, there were taking chances.
I had been asked to actually be a playmate and I turned it down because I thought, no,
I'm an actress, I can be better than that.
What would you have been asked to be a playmate?
What year would you have been asked to be a playmate?
I was asked to be a playmate a couple times in the 80s and also in the 90s, not as serious
in the 90s, but in the 80s, a couple times because for various reasons, I was actually asked
to be a centerfold in the 80s.
It's a long story, but they actually started like kind of grooming me.
I was doing some photo sessions and I went, I don't want to do it.
My dad was still alive at the time.
My dad died in 1995 and I just literally felt like I didn't want to.
I don't know, but funny enough because Sharon Stone and all that, they were taking their
clothes off and doing all these racy things and it was considered at the time sort of
cool because it's a movie and so Andrew Stevens was looking for the next Shannon
Tweed or Sharon Stone for the lower B movie like whatever and at the time B movies were
considered kind of cool, especially like erotic thrillers and stuff like that, kind of
cool.
And I thought, all right, I'm going to break in, I'm going to go after those type of roles
and then hopefully get bigger roles and things like that.
I got, I think it's woman scorned or won't love us before that.
I can't remember.
You were scorned?
You did scorn too, right?
Yeah, I did scorned too, but there were other movies before that that weren't, I can't
remember.
I've done so many movies.
I know you've got 70.
I've counted.
That's the same.
Oh, that's ridiculous.
That's insane.
Oh, so, so, um, can you really not even think, can, can you really not tell me, can you
I'm thinking, can you have a name?
You've been in so many of them.
Oh, I've been, I can name a bunch, but I know that would be, that would be a quiz that
I would probably fail.
That's good.
Obviously the bigger movies, obviously, you know, legally blonde, of course, I know, and
there's, there's, you know, I was on a series.
Not everybody might know, but it was popular.
It was called Sherman Oaks.
It was on Showtime.
I was on a, that was a really fun series comedy series.
Anyways, so I've done a lot of different things, not all of them, that's the other thing.
You do a lot of different things from being a guest on married with children to, uh, I
had a, uh, a guest on days of our lives, all these different things.
I've done a lot of different things, but it's the ones that are scandalous that everybody
is talking about.
They're like, oh, yeah, she was in this movie and she was naked.
Uh, it's naked.
It's a technical term.
No, no, no.
So my point is, is that I, they were doing this huge casting call in Los Angeles trying
to find the next Shen and Tweed, Sharon Stone, and they were seeing everybody.
So when you, Tony, when you say huge casting call, it was kind of, like, what kind of numbers
are we talking?
500 girls?
Huh?
Like 500 actresses.
No, like, thousands.
Oh my god.
No, thousands.
Now remember, this is when basic and stanked and everything and think about how many girls
even want to be playmates and to like, and this wasn't a playmate movie.
This was just Shen and Shen and Tweed was a playmate of the year, right?
And I'm a little younger than her.
So they were looking for the best, you know, Shen and Tweed, Sharon Stone, and even though
I was kind of like, okay, you know, and so, um, you know, you know, you know, I'm like,
that took my career in a path that was a little bit like a rollercoaster, right?
You know, like, we were just talking about how, as actors, you know, how it is sort of,
like, it can take a swallow you up, right?
So I'm getting decent roles, you know, I get promised a role is not going to be to be.
And then I'm on set and I'm going, holy, Lordic atorty, this movie is not any good.
It's in fact, it's terrible.
I'm calling my manager and I'm like, this is awful.
And then you, then you get-
Can you quit?
Huh?
Can you quit?
Um, you can, but you can, I did walk off a set one time and that was not good.
But um, that's a whole nother ball of wax, but you, you, you, you shouldn't.
My problem is I'm very, not problem, but I'm very ethical.
I'm kind of old Hollywood as far as handshakes.
People that know me, I feel I can confidently say I have a good reputation, but if I say
I'm going to do something, I do something and it's followed through for me as a producer
and a director.
So if I say I'm going to do it, I do it, um, handshake deals also work with me.
Obviously when we really get to the mini gritty contracts or a must, um, I've been burned
on handshake deals sometimes when I've been a producer and as I look up, I'm going to
help you bring this to this and the next thing, no, they go behind me.
So I've, I've had that happen.
But, uh, no, I'm, I'm an ethical person.
So usually if I say I'm going to do something and I say usually only if there's something
really bad is happening to me and it's obvious, I need to split, you know, but when ended
up happening at the end of the day, I started getting too many movies that were too silly,
erotic and were not anywhere near what I wanted to do.
And it was after my father passed away and I literally felt a teeny bit lost, you know,
and kind of like, God, I don't even know where my career is going.
You know, my singing career, you know, you get those laws, but I, again, I'm a lot like
that get up back up on the horse and I literally told my agent, my manager, I said, I'm not
doing those kind of movies anymore, I can quit.
So, you mentioned something that I hadn't thought about, which was God in the 80s and 90s,
there was that period there where you had these big time films and one of the hooks was
the actress takes a shirt off, right?
For sure.
And that's all it was.
It was just, it was basically a glorified topless scene, although certainly basic instinct pushed
it a little bit and then obviously the one with Sharon Stone, basically fatal attraction
did it and then basic instinct took it to, you know, even further down the line.
I thought for the longest time, because I've interviewed an actress who had done Playboy.
She had been an actress and now she's on Inside Edition and she had done Playboy.
She's like, I have no regrets about this at all.
And I'm reading an interview and you remember, she did the same thing.
Remember Rachel Ward?
Yes, she did.
Every time we had a big Rachel Ward was for a while, so she's Australian and she was
a total sex symbol and she's, man, probably in her 50s doing the interview and she's
like, I should have done it more.
I should have done those.
I should have done love scenes more or top of any of that stuff when I had the body to
do it.
I should have done it more.
And now obviously, societies, views on all that have changed exponentially because it's
just also available now.
Yes.
And you look back on that period of time when you did sort of the scandalous, racy stuff.
Do you have any regrets about any of that stuff?
Yes.
That's all right.
When a movie, I, when they started to look like, or no, pissed me off.
Especially when I, you see, this is what happens to an actor.
You read a script and it says love scene.
It doesn't say how graphic they want to do it and how graphic they want to shoot it.
So it just says love scene.
That's it.
Well, no, it'll say, you know, some this, some that, but it doesn't, it, they usually,
it's not like every little movement is not in there.
And also you have to remember what the camera sees or doesn't see.
And I, I, I've been doing this a long time as a producer, director and editor.
And also actually one camera, too, if I have many times, especially for documentaries
and things like that, when a national journalism award for love, Betty White with Carlos
Mascot for her.
I was going to ask you about that by the way, the girl.
Yeah.
No, no, no, no, I ran camera for that.
I had my own cameras.
I, I'd be the girl that you, it's just, I don't think it's impossible to do all those
things.
My point is you could have a master shot, a wide shot and you see the whole body and
you, or you could do a, a, a, see you and you see the eyes and the mouth and the kissing
or you can, you know, pan and tilt and get too close to something you shouldn't.
And then of course, it's how the editor puts it in the movie.
So you see what I'm saying?
So you're just as naked in a $50 million film.
Sorry.
As you are in a low budget.
You're just as naked.
It's just, it's a matter of how they package it and how they put it together.
So obviously, when you're doing something that's, the script itself is just a little bit
more tilted towards all the sex and the nudity, you're going to get what you get.
However, let's talk about eyes, white, wide shot with Tom Cruise and his wife at the time.
Oh my god, I'm having a mind blank, you know, the Colchidman.
The Colchidman.
There's the director and Stan McCubrick was the director.
So anything he does is great, right?
Right.
Let's talk about that movie.
How much nudity was there and how much sex?
So those actors were naked all day long, all day long, all day long for day, after day,
after day, after day, after day.
Believe it or not, I'm a lower budget movies.
It'll be just like maybe an afternoon because you got to move and it's move on.
So it's not what you're doing.
It's how it's presented in the long.
I've never done a real porno ever.
That was one thing that got me bugged is like all of a sudden I had fans emailing me thinking
that it was real because of the way it was cut and edited together.
They thought it was real and I was like, oh god, no.
I don't.
No offense to anybody that does that.
You do you, you do you.
That's not what I wanted to do and that's when I said no, I quit.
So I switched agencies and then that's when I actually got legally blonde and another
couple movies.
There was one movie that I did, I wish I had my own credentials up here that had some
nudity in it, but it was the same at all was totally different.
But yeah, and then, and then after my daughter was born, I could have kept working.
It wasn't that.
It's just I, my daughter was born and I just decided I wanted to be a mom.
You know, I didn't want to miss all that.
So I focused more on being a mom and kept working but more as a producer director writer.
As I've looked in that you said, so of all the movies and you did, you know, horror movies
and things like that.
Yeah.
And I love asking this question and there's probably more than one answer of all of the ways
that your character has been killed.
Yeah.
Right.
I love it.
You know this.
Well, it's research.
I love it.
You know that.
Okay.
So when you look at it and like you mentioned days of our lives, I grew up on days of our
lives.
I watched days of our lives.
I loved going home.
I loved going home.
I loved watching days of our lives.
So when you look at your career and all the different ways that you got killed, what
were some of the more memorable ones that you thought, oh, that was good.
That was a good way to die.
Dang it.
What some of these movies have.
Oh, what do I got one?
Was not how we got killed.
Oh, okay.
I got a funny one.
Targeted seduction is a movie that I play and I'm blowing the whole thing because I
am the killer.
So sorry, people.
Sorry.
I'm not going to give it away.
I am the killer.
So in the movie, you think that the killer is this kind of thin sort of guy wearing all
black and a mask and this whole thing.
And then if I see this is so funny because I have to think, how did I die in this movie?
So this is before I actually died, which is so funny.
In the scene, I'm supposed to break in, attack this girl, throw her down on the couch,
try to choke her out if I remember this correctly.
And she's supposed to like choking dying, right?
She's reaching like this to try to get something to hit me with.
And the, the, the, the, the stunt coordinator had her, was there a stunt coordinator there?
Had them grab a phone, like an old phone, like a phone, rotary, and she grabs the phone
and we rehearsed it.
And I'm wearing this black like ski mask and I, and I told her that a lot of fighting
and stuff.
You know, I said, my arms are going to be this distant.
So you're going to make sure that you come in and I'm, you know, so you don't actually
hit me.
Well, and then she did it right every single time.
So it crosses.
So this big phone goes like this, and I go, right, well, we actually are filming.
She grabs the phone and, and the excitement swings and clocks me right in the head.
But, but, how are, but it's like a plastic phone and I'm wearing a ski, like a ski mask.
Not plastic, but like, you know, it's one of those old rotary.
And it literally goes like this, don't.
Did you keep the shot?
We used the shot.
Good.
What was funny?
It was a thing.
And then, and I go flying because I stay into character and the director goes, oh my god,
everybody's like, because I got hit hard, and I'm on the ground going, I couldn't believe.
And then the other really good was a movie called Midnight Tees.
I'm not naked at all in that movie.
And I play.
So I'm really disappointed by that.
I'm not naked.
I play the killer.
And it's more about how I almost kill one of my last victims that's pretty intense.
I put a plastic bag over her and I'm a method actress.
So if I want to drum up some serious anger, it's real.
Oh, I said to the director and stuff like that and we're doing the choreography.
I said, I was supposed to grab her and like throw around the room.
I said, you know, I don't want to hurt her.
I'm going to do everything I can to be professional.
So I'm going to take the plastic bag, put it overhead.
I'm going to grab her and have her push her back into me.
And then you'll have the shots get the director in me that you'd be the shot and you're the
camera.
Right?
And I'm holding her like this.
Her head's here.
She's dying with the plastic over and I'm just going like that and I'm putting my back
against the wall because that way we're safe and she doesn't get hurt and all this kind
of stuff.
That was super, super scary as far as how it was coordinated.
And then I can't remember the actor that comes in.
He played like an iron side type of a role, really good actor.
Donna mad at myself or not, you know, he comes in and like, I mean, iron tide like he's
in a wheelchair.
He's not really, but he's playing that one.
And he takes out his gun and he says, you know, so I think my character's name and he says,
you know, like over, like over, and then he shoots me.
But I got to play such an absolute insane, crazy person.
So even though it's a B movie, and all that kind of stuff, I get excited when I get to
just completely as an actor, say, emote and really, emote and really, you know, let myself
fall into the character and it's absolute doubt, you know.
So those are probably my favorite.
So, you know, I don't regret those at all.
Well, what's more difficult?
You mentioned it where you, I see stories sometimes where people get really hurt.
You get hit on the head.
Now, obviously, it didn't hurt you that bad, but so what's more difficult to shoot because
it sounds like shooting a love scene can be miserable, like not fun, awkward, clunky, whatever.
So what's more difficult to shoot, Tony, a love scene or a scene involving a lot of action
where they're swinging, there's weapons, which one's tougher?
And I appreciate that you know that I've done all that.
I really do.
That's sort of like different categories.
A love scene where it's a crappy movie and I'm annoyed.
I don't love it at all, so I'm annoyed.
And I'm just acting, and this is like, can we be over with this fakey love scene?
Do you like, Tony, what do you do if you don't like the guy?
You just like acting.
You just don't like people.
I mean, I like people in general.
I'm not difficult on set and everything like that, but you know, I just professional and
just straightforward.
And if I don't like something that somebody's doing, I'll tell them.
But since you're talking about things that are difficult, we'll start.
I've got two really good stories, I think.
There was an action film that I did.
Not too many people saw it, but it's called Tequila Express, Christopher Ackin stars
and I star in it.
And there's a stunt coordinator that he and I are, he sees this, Mark Stephen Grove.
We are the best of friends and we're working on a couple of projects together.
We met there, and I knew, I knew martial arts, but I worked heavily with him when we were
doing the scene.
And we had a little bit of an accident.
So there's a scene where I do a spiny, any actors, fighters out there, a spinning crescent
kick and all this different kind of stuff.
And we're out in the desert and he's such a great athlete, you know, martial arts stuntman.
I do a spinning, I'm just regular, I can't remember.
Spin kick?
And I go, what?
And he does this fly backwards just on his own accord hits the dirt.
And in the script, I'm supposed to, I'm wearing these like army boots, right?
And I'm supposed to just stomp his chest like like like that.
And it's on a wide, it's on a master.
So I'm doing it over and over again, but I'm trying to not really hurt him.
So I'm just kind of going, and I'm not really giving the impact that he thinks it needs.
And so he's like, come on, and you know, you can just really like, you know, really,
and I'm, my upper body's really doing it, but I'm not connecting enough with the boot.
Believe it or not, the way it was shot, he says, you can just connect, and I'm going
to tap in like that.
So he's on the ground.
So we do, we were, we were last take because it was really good.
Spinning crescent cut.
He goes like, hit the dirt and I go, wow, with my, and, and the director's like, cut.
And I get up and I'm like, wow, and I'm staying in character because I beat this guy up.
And he's on the ground just like, oh, like that.
And I'm thinking, wow, I didn't know this is acting so good.
I look, now, remember, we're in the middle of the desert shooting this.
He's going, and I'm like, oh, my God, Mark, are you with, he calls, cut the dirt, calls
got to go.
Are you really okay?
And he's like, in his chest right here.
It was a giant cactus, piece of cactus that had stuck to my boot, never the whole time
had never done it.
Look, that one take that is stuck to my boot.
So when I stumped him, he had a cactus about this long, maybe I'm exaggerating.
And he pulled it out and I was like, oh, my God.
So yes, those things happen.
And there's plenty of those stories.
But they use that take, right?
Oh, yeah.
That's great.
And oh, God.
Mark's even grove.
Maybe this.
You're going to get a laugh.
Well, you know, I hear a horror story sometimes about directors, like I watched a whole documentary
on the making of the actresses.
And William freaking, I can't remember the actress's time.
It almost sounded like abuse.
I hear some of these stories sometimes what these directors will put actors and actresses
through.
And I'm like, what are you trying to do to these people?
Yeah.
And it sounds like sometimes in order to get that reaction, but you did unintentionally.
That's what they're trying to do.
Yes.
Have you run into that?
You're like, what are you trying to do to me?
Yeah.
I'm not going to say who, but I.
Yeah.
But if they really pissed me off, I will give them what for.
So.
Okay.
So now we, okay.
So now let's go down to you start doing something that is near and dear to my heart.
I think the whole genre of documentaries has exploded.
It's not just Ken Burns thing.
It's not just a niche thing.
Now every, you know, a lot of people are making a lot of them are really, really good.
You've won some awards for some, but you made two that really interested me.
You chronicled, maybe arguably the most popular female film TV star in the last 50 years
in Betty White.
Love Betty White, the Betty White storyline.
What prompted you to do that?
Like how did you, like of all, like I'm like, how did she hold time?
Like what?
Betty White?
What's the connection there?
Well, I have to give credit first and foremost to the anchor news anchor Carlos Amesco.
It was a really good friend of mine.
So he and I started Carlos Amesco was a news anchor for Fox News, Los Angeles.
And he had a contract with them to do these documentaries that not are just for Fox News,
but they could, they could be syndicated for all the United States, Fox anyways.
And I started working with him because I was a professional editor.
Look at me.
Get your diploma.
Media services.
And quickly, I got to tell you the story because it's kind of cute.
How he and I are initially met.
He came in to all media service.
Greg Pineda was the guy that owned the company and I got hired.
This is long time ago because he saw my work.
I was looking for work.
I wanted to work as an editor, not just being actress.
I wanted some side work.
And he went, oh my God, you can actually edit.
So anyways, so I got the job and how it worked is that this company, like any other professional
editing studio, you can get, if you come in and you need something edited and they're
going to hire it, you're going to, they will assign you to an editor and that editor
will work with you.
And this place was like this long hallway and each editor had their own editing bay.
And so when we were in the main lobby, he might, uh, Greg Pineda introduced me to Carlos
Meswella and he said, this will be your editor today.
And Carlos very sweetly went like, okay, like that.
And so now remember, I do not look like an editor, right?
So we're walking down, so we're walking down the hallway.
You're right.
You stood out.
Got it.
Yeah.
And also, you know, I'm an actress and you might have, who knows, recognize it.
I'm walking down this hallway and I glance back because I can tell they're talking and
I glance back and I see Carlos very sweetly looking back as Greg Pineda because he's a friend
of his.
He goes, she really edit and he says, oh, she is a girl.
Yeah.
And he's trying to whisper it and I catch him saying it because I turn and look and he
goes, oh, my God.
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry.
And Greg goes, she's really good.
She's technically really good.
And he goes, okay, God.
I'm so sorry.
I'm so sorry.
So we walk in and we end up becoming the best of friends and I edit a music video or something
for him that he and his brothers were doing.
And then I became his favorite editor.
And so then we started because I do everything, produce and direct and all that kind of stuff.
So after, you know, time working together with him, he wanted to do these documentaries.
He says, my dog.
Okay.
Wow.
And so.
Well, I'm a dog person.
What's his name?
My adopted puppy.
So what's your name?
This is Kai.
There we go.
And so, you know, he, I would like him to partner with him and to start doing these documentaries.
And this is a true story, not the Betty White one because there was one, there was several
before this one, Betty White, his documentary with, he and I, I can't remember which one
it was.
We did so many.
Come on.
Get down.
Sorry.
It's like having a great shot.
We should take a picture of that.
Truly HD aired documentary for Fox News LA.
And now, now reason why that seems a little bit surprising is HD is who, of course,
it's been going on a really, really long time.
But this is like 20 years ago, maybe, yeah, it's about that long ago.
And it wasn't the Betty White one because that wasn't the first one that was like before
that.
A lot of news at the time was air, it was, would be in HD, the station, everything they
would air.
And then often there off the street stories were in HD for always maybe going to get
too technical.
But the longer stories or the specials would have to go into the network that they would
have.
These huge, it's like hard drive spaces where it's like, you know, media was held and
it would be combined.
That's a great.
It would be compressed.
And that's how they used to have to do it.
So then when they would air these specials, they would be standard definition.
And it would not have the beauty of the clear, because they would compress it.
You know, that was 20 years ago, right?
It's been that long, really?
Yeah.
So when it ended up happening, well, the Betty White story was, I don't know, maybe 15
years ago to look at, I can't remember long, maybe 12 years ago, I don't remember, but
I went into the, their main hub and where they do everything and make a long story short.
I was absolutely crazy.
And I insisted that our specials would air and I could get too technical to tell you
how we did it.
But we work with the control room.
We got them to do it.
And you should have seen all these Fox news people looking at this blonde marching around
going, ours is going to be HD.
It's going to air by HD.
And they're like, oh, check.
And I'm like, no.
And so Carlos gave me the name, Tenacious Tee.
Tenacious Tee?
Yeah.
So we did a whole bunch of them together, like a whole.
So you did one on, but did you, by any chance, did your paths have a cross?
Me and Betty White.
She's a lot older.
That's a different generation.
We had not, when we shot the Betty White interviews, I did talk to her because she had
work with my father on murder with, no, not murder sure.
She worked with him on something else.
I can't remember what, what it was.
And she knew who he was and I literally was with her holding my arm.
I walked her to this, her seat.
So she came at comfortable and she was so kind and so spried, funny and everything
like that.
I don't normally get this way, but I literally was like halfway going to cry because I was
so honored that I was going to be doing that lucky enough to be getting producer credit
and with Carlos and everybody like that on this project and be directing the camera crew
and everything like that.
I just felt so honored.
I was like, I was literally biting the side of my cheek.
No, it's me.
No.
We also interviewed a whole bunch of other celebrities as well.
We did quite a few people.
If you look at my rights, no, it's a mile long when you did another one, you did the Hugh
Heffner story.
We did.
And when you were younger, did you ever go to the house?
Did you ever go to the mansion?
Yes.
I did go to the mansion for a bunch of different parties and things like that.
It was fun and wild and crazy.
So when you shot that, when you produced a documentary, were you able to do anything
and because of your experience, however many years ago, and now you're in a different
chair and you're producing a documentary about this man, did it allow you to do anything
creatively or maybe even offer any insight because you had those experiences that somebody
else maybe wouldn't have thought to do.
You're like, oh, no, no, no, I was there.
I know what this was like.
What was really great about working with Carlos Mescrow is that when I would be in my editing
bag with all the material, he would leave me alone basically as far as, you know, they
would give me a transcript of how they wanted to cut it basically with transcript.
But then everything else, if you get a chance, you can watch it on my website, McClureFilms.com
and also beyond TV.
There's two different ways you can still watch the series, but are these episodes.
But these documentary, but I had free reign.
So when an editor has an amazing amount of control about how a film, a TV show, a documentary,
a commercial, makes you feel, you can make somebody look good, you can make somebody
and how I ended up feeling about who you have, and I felt, I want to say sorry for him,
but I had empathy for him more than I think I did prior.
So.
Because I was going to ask you something, and I did not expect you to say that.
What prompted you to have that feeling, empathy, and it's different than sympathy.
That's a big difference, but I haven't heard anybody in your position has a very controversial
figure.
What was it about him when you watched it and you were producing it, that created that
emotion.
Anybody who wants to watch it, go to McClureFilms.com.
I want to see it now, okay.
Yeah, you have to go look at the documentary side of links, and you could see it.
And also on beyond TV, it's on beyond B-O-B-E-O-N-D-T-V.com, which is Carlisabeth station.
You can learn about how he grew up and who he wanted to be.
And yet with all his, at the end of the day, he was an elderly man that, you know, when
I picked up on loneliness, he was able to do a lot of the things he wanted to do, and
yes, he made a lot of money, but there was still something that I felt that was missing
in him that I picked up on.
And I tried to have empathy for the overview of what he wanted to do or what he thought
he wanted to do.
And if you read it, or you tape it up, if you watch it, he really, he wanted to be like
an animator, like a cartoonist.
He wanted to be, he wanted to write books and go watch it.
There's a lot of things that he wanted to do, and he didn't connect with women on a real
in my opinion.
In a real, serious, maybe I'm wrong, but emotional level, he saw women slightly differently
than, hopefully, a man that I would be involved with, is.
And I actually had empathy for that.
I felt bad for him, maybe I felt bad, you're right.
But everybody, there were things about him that I actually liked.
So, you know, I have this theory, and that's how I direct movies, too.
And you have a movie that you're directing.
And it's about, there's one I'm supposed to direct, and I'm not going to say the name
because we don't have all the bells almost everything put together yet.
Where the two main characters are actually both kind of bad guys, to be honest, they're
both bad guys.
And you follow them through all their antics that they do through the whole movie, it's
an action movie.
One might wonder if you don't have any relateability to each one of those characters, no likeability.
Why do you even want to watch them?
And that is the same with when I play killers.
Maybe you're like my therapist right now because I make your answering my own questions
about myself.
You can't say your appointment for the week.
Right.
You save $100.
Right, when you, when you play, let's say a killer or something like that, there's
something that you have to relate to and ask any actor in general.
If they have to find something that they have empathy for or understand or can relate
to even somebody that is penis or whatever, and it's the same thing with directing a movie.
You can't just have two bad guys.
You can if you want, and I think it's a bit of a lousy movie, and you have them one dimensional
and just killers.
There has to be something that you can relate to, especially if they're main characters.
They're just, you know, the antagonist, you know, they're just the bad guy sure you
can kind of make them one dimensional calorie.
But they're more interesting and more intriguing if they have multi dimensions.
So that's, that's my thought.
You know, it's interesting.
You should say that because I am, and I know you've seen it, you've produced it, you've
watched it.
We are seeing now more than ever movies and television shows delve into these story arcs
where everybody's the bad guy and nobody's likable.
I'm like, why am I watching this?
Oh, I can't watch it.
I'll start to turn it off.
I've done that.
And I don't know if it's because, but I know sometimes it's really popular, but I'm
done with you time.
I'm like, why do I want to watch this guy?
Everybody hears a scumbag.
Right.
What do you think?
I'm hoping you liked me when you said you're asking me about how many times it got killed.
Yeah.
Okay.
I've taken you for, I've taken a million of time.
You wrote a book, Rescue Heart.
Yeah.
You, this is, this is the part.
And I don't think I would have appreciated this when I was 25.
But now that I'm 51, I appreciate longevity and professionals in careers that are extremely
hard.
People who keep working and keep lasting, whether it's journalism or music or movies and
what you do, because I don't think the audience or the consumer has any idea how hard it is.
And I have just so much respect for that for anybody.
So I'm looking at your bio 71 movies credited as an actress.
18 is a producer.
13 is a director.
14 as an editor.
By the way, you can't be an editor.
10 is a writer.
Right.
Six soundtrack credits.
Married.
Daughter Kayla.
Uh, and apparently I, I've known this because I follow you on Instagram.
And apparently you're quite the horse person.
Western writer.
I can't say horseman.
That's a question.
There we go.
There's a question.
Ton of all of the things that we talked about.
Maybe we didn't.
What are the ones with your family?
Take your family off the table because we know.
I can't say that.
Yeah.
So of all the stuff that you've done.
What are you most proud of?
Wow.
It's tough.
The reason why it's tough is because I'm such a.
Believer and being limitless.
That so many of those different things are a piece of who I am.
So saying something is my most proud makes me almost feel like I'm saying something else isn't.
So it's extraordinarily tough.
Being that I'm more of a here and now kind of a person.
And I think my dad would be extraordinary.
I love my dad very much and again, he passed away in 1995.
I think my dad would be extraordinarily proud of now how I'm producing and directing.
And the movie that I'm.
Actually still working on it, even though we have a short version of it.
It's going to the film festivals for the following version.
We're still working on it.
Last flair is beautiful.
I'm so proud of the movie.
I have other.
I have more movies coming out soon that are in pre production.
I think he would be most proud of me because of that.
And possibly because I think he would be most proud of me.
And I think I realize becoming a producer and director and editor encompasses all of the things that I've done over the years.
I'm probably most proud of that.
And why it encompasses all of those things.
Use every element that I have learned to become a producer director editor.
Thank you.
I can't thank you enough.
I've been wanting to do this forever and you've been so patient and so kind.
You know, just taking my request.
So thank you very much.
I congratulate you on all your success.
This is this was a lot of fun.
Thank you.
I'm honored that you remembered so many things.
I appreciate it.
You take it.
All right.
You got me burning.
You got me burning.
You got me burning.
This is a stolen water media production.